80s TV Ladies Ep. 229 - Moonlighting | The 90s TV Babies - Transcript

[00:00:00 - 00:00:02] Melissa Roth

Weirding Way Media

[Singing] Amy Englehardt: 80s TV Ladies, So sexy and so pretty. 80s TV Ladies, Steppin’ out into the city. 80s TV Ladies, often treated kind of sh-[wolf whistle]. Working hard for the money in a man’s world. 80s TV Ladies!

[00:00:24 - 00:00:34] Melissa Roth

This is 80s TV Ladies, where we explore the fabulous female driven television shows of the 19 eighties with your hosts, Susan Lambert Hatem and Sharon Johnson. 

[00:00:35 - 00:00:36] Sharon Johnson

Hello I’m Sharon

[00:00:36 - 00:00:37] Susan Lambert Hatem

And I’m Susan

[00:00:37 - 00:01:31] Sharon Johnson

For the last few weeks, we've really been enjoying looking back at moonlighting. I remembered it fondly. Honestly, didn't remember a lot of the specifics. Honestly, didn't remember a lot of the specifics. So it has been really educational looking back on it. There's a lot of the show that I really admire, and the more I've learned about some of the challenges that the production faced, it it makes my admiration level go up.

I admire the performances, but, you know, it's a it's a hit or miss. A lot of the episodes held up really well. Some of them not so much because of a lot of it having to do with things outside of the control of the show. So, but overall, this has really been wonderful to look back.

[00:01:32 - 00:02:28] Susan Lambert Hatem

I agree, Sharon. You know, I was skeptical, starting the rewatch. A little worried that it might age poorly, because it was so of its time. I really loved it, remember loving it. I, but I think it is absolutely worth watching again. It's odder and more interesting than I remember. It's, occasionally uneven.

Like, there are some episodes that are not as good as others. Which is true of any show. Which is true of any show, particularly from the eighties. Yes. We've always see a little bit of a drop in that those those later 90s, but I appreciate it more than I thought I would. I I appreciate the humor of it. I appreciate the 4th wall breaking.

I appreciate the experimentation in almost every episode trying something that just hadn't been done in eighties television.

[00:02:29 - 00:02:52] Sharon Johnson

Or since, the audacity of it, the the willingness of Glenn Gordon Caron to just say, we're gonna try all kinds of stuff and do it. And the fact that the network said, okay, it it boggles the mind on some level. It really does.

[00:02:52 - 00:03:28] Susan Lambert Hatem

And as we are talking to people and and realizing that 90s that is challenging as the show was behind the scenes, it also was people having a lot of fun because I think they knew they were working on something very unique. And and and, certainly, it seems like most people were enjoying it even amongst the stress of it. Mhmm. And, hopefully, I think are able to appreciate it now that there's just been some time because you're like, oh, it wasn't that bad.

Because that's how you remember things. It was fine. I'm here. But yeah. Yeah.

[00:03:28 - 00:03:46] Sharon Johnson

But nevertheless, it you know, it's it's good to get another perspective, especially from our nineties TV Babies who always bring lots of surprises and insights that that we just really appreciate. So So indeed, it is time to bring

[00:03:46 - 00:03:56] Susan Lambert Hatem

in the nineties TV babies, our awesome friends who were all born in the nineties, various times throughout the nineties to watch these shows for the first time and tell us what they think.

[00:03:57 - 00:04:10] Sharon Johnson

Sarita Fontanesi, who is a podcaster, content creator, and training facilitator in diverse progressive sectors and electoral politics. She lives in Austin, Texas. And Sergio Perez

[00:04:10 - 00:04:28] Susan Lambert Hatem

is an actor, director, and playwright who lives in Los Angeles. He also works with me at 90s TV Ladies and our producing company, 130 4 West. So while he's the youngest of our nineties TV babies, he also has a little bit of insider info because he hears about these shows long before we give him assignments.

[00:04:29 - 00:04:37] Sharon Johnson

And last but not least, Megan Ruble is an actress, singer, and amazing person who lives locally here in the San Fernando Valley.

[00:04:38 - 00:05:11] Susan Lambert Hatem

It's important to note that part of the reason, Sharon, we bring on the nineties TV Babies is to get a different perspective. We are looking at these shows often because we love them, I think, and because we you know, but we're also looking at them through the lens of nostalgia. You know? We saw them when we were young. We saw them when we were growing up. We saw them when we were formulating ideas of the world. We saw them in the eighties, 40 years ago.

And so I I I sort of think it's important to have a different perspective. Absolutely.

[00:05:13 - 00:05:29] Sharon Johnson

Because we bring an understanding of the context of what the seventies, eighties, nineties, etcetera, bring to our viewing of these shows in a different way than it is for someone like our nineties TV babies that didn't experience it.

[00:05:29 - 00:05:29] Susan Lambert Hatem

Because

[00:05:29 - 00:05:31] Sharon Johnson

they're babies. That's right.

[00:05:31 - 00:06:05] Susan Lambert Hatem

I think it's vital to have these different perspectives. We didn't have access to that kind of communication, when we were growing up. We didn't, you know, the world the world changes and is supposed to change. So I I don't know. I just I wanted to, like, sort of point out why I love bringing them on and love hearing from them even if sometimes they put a little pin in the balloon of things for me. Because sometimes I'm so expecting them. I'm like, they're gonna love this one, and then they don't.

[00:06:06 - 00:06:51] Sharon Johnson

I've gotten it wrong every time when I've just thought, oh, I they're gonna feel this way about it, and they're kind of on the opposite end of the spectrum. And that's okay. That that has been something that that I have gotten out of this segment, that gotten out of these episodes that I was not expecting. It's so it's been so great to hear what they have to say, to listen to their thoughts about it. And it helps in some ways for me to put things in in a context I hadn't thought about before hasn't changed my thoughts, I have to say, about what I have felt about these shows before I talk to them, but it also it's always good to get somebody else's perspective because we don't all think about things the same way.

[00:06:51 - 00:07:21] Susan Lambert Hatem

And that, you know, and that diversity is our strength. I have kids, and you often wanna show them something and be like, don't you wanna love this as much as I loved it? And and they don't always.

Sometimes they do, and I kind of learned something too. You sort of get a perspective on the eighties that I don't get when I'm just thinking about it.

Anyway, let's get to it. Absolutely. And they're gonna surprise me.

[00:07:22 - 00:07:35] Sharon Johnson

Let's go. Please welcome back to 80s TV Ladies, the absolutely fabulous nineties TV 90s, Serena Fontanesi, Sergio Perez, and Megan Ruble. Welcome back, guys.

[00:07:36 - 00:07:37] Susan Lambert Hatem

Hi. Hello.

[00:07:37 - 00:07:39] Sergio Perez

Hello. Thanks for having us back.

[00:07:39 - 00:07:45] Susan Lambert Hatem

It has been a while. How is everyone? How is 2024 treating you?

[00:07:46 - 00:07:55] Megan Ruble

Amazingly. So much happening at the same time, though. I would like 80s to calm down. How are you doing though, Sergio?

[00:07:56 - 00:08:15] Sergio Perez

2024 is crazy. I I cannot believe that it is already March that I feel like I was just in the Philippines counting down to Jan like, January 1st, but now I'm here in my home on in in March, which is wild.

[00:08:16 - 00:08:21] Susan Lambert Hatem

It's moving quickly, very, very quickly. And you but you you over the holidays, you were in the Philippines.

[00:08:21 - 00:08:33] Sergio Perez

Yes. I was.

I went for a family reunion. It was so much fun. I had a great time. I think this is the first time I've been where I was like, maybe I could I could live here Babies.

[00:08:33 - 00:08:34] Susan Lambert Hatem

Oh.

[00:08:34 - 00:08:37] Sergio Perez

I'm not gonna make any decisions right now. Good to

[00:08:37 - 00:08:38] Sharon Johnson

have options, though.

[00:08:39 - 00:09:06] Sergio Perez

Oh, actually, I have it right here. For those of you who are listening, my mom gave me this book of heirloom recipes, from the province that she is from in the Philippines. So it's like kapampangan 90s, And the really cool thing about it is that we learned, because there is a family tree in here, that we are very distantly related to the woman who wrote this.

[00:09:07 - 00:09:09] Sharon Johnson

Oh, wow. What?

[00:09:09 - 00:09:10] Megan Ruble

Mhmm. That's so cool.

[00:09:11 - 00:09:14] Susan Lambert Hatem

That is so cool. Did you get it in the Philippines when you were there? Or your

[00:09:14 - 00:09:34] Sergio Perez

Yeah. Yeah. Because, like, my mom, she's who I learned everything from. So, like, she is the one who is the chef in the family. And so when she was there, she visited this restaurant and, bought one of these books. Hang on.

Here it is. Right here.

[00:09:34 - 00:09:36] Susan Lambert Hatem

Oh my goodness.

[00:09:36 - 00:09:43] Sergio Perez

Right there. It says, Manulett. That's my mom's maiden name. So that is this person's grandmother.

[00:09:44 - 00:09:44] Sharon Johnson

Wow.

[00:09:44 - 00:09:50] Sergio Perez

And she is maybe, like, in her nineties. So she's old, and it goes really, really far back.

[00:09:51 - 00:10:01] Susan Lambert Hatem

Wow. That is amazing.

And so can can are we gonna be able to put this in our audiography? Are people gonna be able to go check it out, or do you have to go to the restaurant in the Philippines to get it?

[00:10:01 - 00:10:04] Sergio Perez

I actually don't know. Alright. Well, look Let me look that up.

[00:10:04 - 00:10:07] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yeah. That is so cool. Tell us the name again, though.

[00:10:08 - 00:10:15] Sergio Perez

Achi Lillian's Heirloom Recipes, romancing the past through traditional kalutung kapampangan, just kapampangan cooking.

[00:10:16 - 00:10:18] Susan Lambert Hatem

And what is kapa pangan?

[00:10:18 - 00:10:25] Sergio Perez

Kapampangan. So, my parents are from Pampanga. And if you're from Pampanga, you're, a Kapampangan.

[00:10:27 - 00:10:29] Susan Lambert Hatem

Ah, okay. Cool. That is amazing.

[00:10:29 - 00:10:30] Sergio Perez

Like an American.

[00:10:30 - 00:10:44] Susan Lambert Hatem

And and so, what what are special so is there anything that you can go oh, and what's special about these dishes is the what's the base of them? What's unique to them?

[00:10:45 - 00:11:26] Sergio Perez

So, everyone in the Philippines thinks that they're the culinary capital, but the real truth is that Pampanga is the culinary capital of the Philippines. And if we have any Filipino listeners, which I know we do because I look at our stats and I know our geography, Don't fight me on this. I would say that, like, I don't even know how to describe it. I just think it's really, really good. And everyone does it differently, even house to house. So there's no one traditional kampan pan in cooking, but, that's what I was raised on. That's what I that's what I, gravitate towards.

[00:11:27 - 00:11:32] Susan Lambert Hatem

That's so cool. That's so great. What a cool thing. Alright. Megan.

[00:11:33 - 00:12:33] Megan Ruble

I'm getting paid to be a producer for the first time. That's a big success for me. Also, for any creative who's had to sit down and figure out what their rate is for something, shout out to all of us having to do that at some time or another because that is a rough emotional, mental, psychological experience trying to be like, what am I worth is, a journey. I get to go home for Easter, and it will also be my cousin's baby's Susan birthday. And I am super excited about that because she is very cute and very smart. And I found out recently that when her mom goes into her room in the morning to be like, you know, hi, sweetie. Good morning.

She tells her mom to sit down in the chair because she's not done being in bed yet, and I think that is the cutest thing. And I will also be telling anyone who tries to wake me up to sit down because I'm not done being in bed yet.

[00:12:34 - 00:12:37] Susan Lambert Hatem

And you're doing a a puppet Shakespeare show on Twitch?

[00:12:38 - 00:13:24] Megan Ruble

I am. So my good friends over at Perception Studios, they've been doing a Shakespeare show called Bartic Inspiration. And, they invited me to come in, and I was like, absolutely. There is nothing I love more than being ridiculous and doing Shakespeare at the same time. But if you do decide to watch, if you tip, Perception Studios and all of the funds go to, like, keeping their Twitch channel alive, basically, you can suggest an accent or impression Gordon member or for the entire cast to do. I am awful at accents. So if you would like to mortify me live on Twitch, somebody come and suggest Scottish again because last time we did that, it was not Scottish.

I'll tell you that.

[00:13:27 - 00:13:27] Susan Lambert Hatem

Serita.

[00:13:29 - 00:13:35] Serita Fontanesi

My dog started what I've been calling reform school, AKA private training sessions.

[00:13:37 - 00:13:38] Susan Lambert Hatem

How's that going?

[00:13:39 - 00:13:49] Serita Fontanesi

It's actually going very well. It's working. So that's very Moonlighting, and the most interesting thing in my life.

[00:13:51 - 00:13:57] Susan Lambert Hatem

Are you going to see the great solar eclipse of 2024?

[00:13:58 - 00:14:08] Serita Fontanesi

I will because it's gonna pass, like, us you're gonna be able to see it in totality, here in Austin. So that is very exciting, and we'll look forward

[00:14:08 - 00:14:08] Sergio Perez

to that.

[00:14:09 - 00:14:30] Susan Lambert Hatem

I have to tell you, I went and saw the 2017 one, and I promised Glenn to myself that I would go to the 2024, which at the time seemed forever. We weren't even sure we were gonna still be alive. Right? I mean, it was like, well, if I'm alive, if we're still in the United States, I'm going.

[00:14:31 - 00:14:33] Serita Fontanesi

No. No. Austin. I've got a guest room.

[00:14:33 - 00:14:52] Susan Lambert Hatem

Okay. Oh. There you go. I might take you up on that. I might take you up on that. Allyce do. Because it is one of the best experiences of my life, experiencing the one in 2017, the total solar eclipse.

The totality means a lot, and it's gonna be longer. It's, like, twice as long.

[00:14:52 - 00:14:54] Serita Fontanesi

Wow. It's a long one.

[00:14:55 - 00:15:06] Susan Lambert Hatem

Alright. We are here to talk about moonlighting. We gave you all an assignment to watch some moonlighting episodes and some clips. Did you have a chance to do that?

[00:15:06 - 00:15:18] Serita Fontanesi

I watched episodes. I managed to forget about the clips. And you were like, they're only, like, 15 and, the way this brain is set up. But I did watch the episodes.

[00:15:18 - 00:15:20] Susan Lambert Hatem

Okay. Cool. Cool. Cool. Cool. Cool.

[00:15:20 - 00:15:25] Sharon Johnson

Alright. Did you watch the bonus episode as well or the just the the, for the extra credit or

[00:15:25 - 00:15:30] Serita Fontanesi

just assigned. Just the assigned. Okay. Yeah. I didn't do the extra credit, which is actually very unlike me.

[00:15:30 - 00:15:43] Susan Lambert Hatem

Well, you just went through Shepherd Tuesday. So I'm and, you know, I'm not getting it. Thank you. Thank you. Megan, Sergio, were you guys able to complete the Moonlighting watching assignment?

[00:15:43 - 00:15:46] Megan Ruble

Yes. Yes. And I watched an extra episode.

[00:15:47 - 00:15:49] Susan Lambert Hatem

Thank god you did. That's okay.

[00:15:49 - 00:15:50] Sergio Perez

I did not watch the extra episode that you

[00:15:50 - 00:15:51] Susan Lambert Hatem

gave us.

[00:15:51 - 00:15:56] Megan Ruble

Oh, no. I mean, even beyond that. Oh. I went and found an extra episode and watched it.

[00:15:56 - 00:16:02] Sharon Johnson

Okay. What was it that made you was there a specific episode you went you went to find?

[00:16:03 - 00:16:12] Megan Ruble

This is so embarrassing. I just wanted to watch them get together. So I looked up what episode they get together for the first time, and I watched that one.

[00:16:12 - 00:16:18] Sharon Johnson

No. Listen. No shade. But that that's kind of what the show's about. You know? Oh, absolutely.

[00:16:20 - 00:16:37] Susan Lambert Hatem

The assignment was to watch, season 1, episode 1, the pilot. And then season 2, episode 3 entitled Money Talks, Maddie Walks. And then season 2, episode 4, the dream sequence always rings twice.

[00:16:37 - 00:16:40] Sharon Johnson

And season 2, episode 80s,

[00:16:40 - 00:16:52] Susan Lambert Hatem

called Camille. The bonus episode that it sounds like Megan watched was from season 3, episode 6, Big Man on Mulberry Street.

[00:16:52 - 00:16:53] Sharon Johnson

One of my favorites.

[00:16:53 - 00:17:29] Susan Lambert Hatem

The musical theater episode. Yes. And then we actually sent a little collection of YouTube scenes and snippets. Sort of takes about 15 minutes to watch them, maybe less, that were just some unique moments from the show that I thought would would give us a little more flavor for our nineties TV babies. So before we get too far into it, what did you know of this show before we started, if anything? And, Sergio, you get to answer from before we started working sensibly on moonlighting.

[00:17:30 - 00:17:48] Sergio Perez

Before we started working on it, I knew nothing about moonlighting. I do remember when it came to streaming, and everybody was like, oh my gosh. Moonlighting streaming now.

That's that's so crazy. And I just it it didn't really mean much to me because I didn't know anything about it, like, at all.

[00:17:49 - 00:17:50] Sharon Johnson

Megan, what about you?

[00:17:50 - 00:17:54] Megan Ruble

Same. Absolutely nothing. Had never heard the title, not a single thing.

[00:17:55 - 00:18:02] Sharon Johnson

Susan. And this is why we're talking to you guys about this show. This is this is this is fascinating. This is very interesting. Sharita.

[00:18:03 - 00:18:20] Serita Fontanesi

I had heard of it, and I thought it was a movie. I had heard of it, and I as soon as I, like, saw, like, Siwalt Shepherd and miss Willis, I was like, oh, right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Okay. I know that this is a thing that exists, but I had never watched it.

[00:18:20 - 00:18:29] Susan Lambert Hatem

Okay. Alright. Alright. And so outside of moonlighting, did you know of Bruce Willis and or Cybill Shepherd and from where?

[00:18:30 - 00:18:34] Serita Fontanesi

Yes. Yeah. I've seen them. I mean, a lot of stuff.

[00:18:34 - 00:18:47] Megan Ruble

I knew of Bruce Willis, not Cybill Shepherd. And my first encounter, I think, with Bruce Willis was bandits, the movie, which is still one of my favorite films.

[00:18:48 - 00:18:49] Susan Lambert Hatem

I don't think I had to

[00:18:49 - 00:18:50] Sharon Johnson

know this movie.

[00:18:50 - 00:18:52] Susan Lambert Hatem

That's a deep cut. Okay.

[00:18:52 - 00:18:53] Megan Ruble

You should watch bandits.

[00:18:53 - 00:18:54] Sharon Johnson

Okay.

[00:18:54 - 00:18:55] Megan Ruble

If you like Bruce Willis

[00:18:55 - 00:18:55] Susan Lambert Hatem

I do.

[00:18:55 - 00:19:03] Megan Ruble

Billy Bob Gordon, and Yeah. Cate Blanchett all being ridiculous together Wow. You should watch Bandits.

[00:19:03 - 00:19:06] Susan Lambert Hatem

Okay. 2001. How did

[00:19:06 - 00:19:08] Sharon Johnson

I miss that? Anyway okay.

[00:19:09 - 00:19:14] Susan Lambert Hatem

Alright. So that was that was your introduction to Bruce Willis. Alright. Sergio

[00:19:14 - 00:19:27] Sergio Perez

I knew of Bruce Willis. I I I don't know. I've never I've never seen anything with him in it.

So this was all new to me. I just yeah.

Or Cybill Shepherd.

[00:19:28 - 00:19:45] Susan Lambert Hatem

Fair enough. So here here's the thing. You know, it's one of those shows, not unlike Remington Steele, where the person that was the star of the show that got the show, we're making this show, was Cybill Shepherd. Because she was the movie star.

[00:19:45 - 00:19:47] Serita Fontanesi

Right. Right. That's why was

[00:19:47 - 00:19:48] Susan Lambert Hatem

sort of making her comeback.

[00:19:48 - 00:19:49] Sergio Perez

Yeah.

[00:19:49 - 00:20:01] Susan Lambert Hatem

And, like, a huge movie star from a very young age. Right. And Bruce Willis was unknown. Like, the network did not want to cast him.

[00:20:01 - 00:20:06] Serita Fontanesi

I didn't know he was unknown. Oh, yeah. I thought he was just, like, new.

[00:20:06 - 00:20:08] Susan Lambert Hatem

He was known in New York.

[00:20:08 - 00:20:17] Sharon Johnson

I don't know that he'd even done anything on film at that point. He was working he was doing theater in New York. He was working as a bartender 90s Sharon told us because she knew him from New York.

[00:20:17 - 00:20:21] Susan Lambert Hatem

And he was in a band. Yeah. Bruno and the something. And

[00:20:21 - 00:20:30] Serita Fontanesi

That's way he would Hatem ruined my life in the early Oh, for sure. 90s would have wrecked my credit.

[00:20:30 - 00:20:40] Susan Lambert Hatem

Like He was more unknown than Pierce Brosnan. Yeah. Because Pierce Brosnan had done a couple of things and had done, you know, some things.

[00:20:40 - 00:20:50] Megan Ruble

That's so wild because the show in so many ways just feels like here's everything Bruce Willis can do. Yes. Like, it it showcases

[00:20:50 - 00:20:52] Serita Fontanesi

feels like a side character.

[00:20:53 - 00:21:19] Megan Ruble

Yeah. Like, it showcases everything he does well. He gets like, honestly, it's an enviable role. He gets, like, the vulnerability that, like, Bruce Willis does actually very well. He gets the, like, kind of, like, snarky sexiness. He gets to be a bat and he gets to be, like, that weird, but also actually legitimately very sexy thing that Bruce Willis Ladies, where you're just like, you would've wrecked my early 20s. Damn it.

[00:21:20 - 00:21:22] Serita Fontanesi

You would have ruined my life.

[00:21:25 - 00:21:28] Susan Lambert Hatem

Okay. High level first thoughts on the show.

[00:21:30 - 00:22:32] Megan Ruble

I loved it. I loved the sense of humor, and I normally am not, like, a pun person either, but I it's more than that. It's not just, like, dumb dad jokes. It's, like, very witty and quick, and I loved that. But it doesn't take itself too seriously, which I also loved. I love a detective show, but, like, you watch 4 episodes of law and order back to back, and you're like, I think I'm depressed. Like, I think I think this has gone a little too deep now.

Whereas this was just fun, and that was so refreshing. I liked its and loved the examples, especially, that you sent of it breaking the 4th wall in such an extreme way. I loved its commitment to that. I loved that it 90s, like, there's no rules around this. Sometimes we'll call sometimes we'll say Bruce Willis. Sometimes we'll say David. Who knows?

I really loved that though. It it never felt pretentious. I think it always felt very genuine, and that's something I really liked about it.

[00:22:33 - 00:22:35] Sharon Johnson

Excellent. Sergio?

[00:22:36 - 00:23:30] Sergio Perez

If you know me, you know I really adore things that are unconventional, witty, clever, and, like, just things that do things that you've never seen before. And even though this came out in the eighties, I was just like, wow. They are doing things that people even today aren't doing. I really enjoyed it. I had a lot of fun. What I love most about it is that 90s I was watching, I I just never knew what to expect. I never knew where they were gonna go.

So, like, not to jump too far ahead, but, like, the season 2 finale, I just kept watching the clock and I saw I had 15 minutes Glenn, and I was just like, oh my god. How are they how are they gonna resolve this?

This is gonna be crazy. What's gonna happen? And then they just did what they did. And I was just so baffled by it, but it was so funny and so good.

[00:23:31 - 00:23:32] Megan Ruble

It's so good.

[00:23:32 - 00:24:04] Sergio Perez

I was amazed. Honestly, I was amazed, and I loved the examples that you sent. I thought the Shakespeare clip was really funny, and, like, just Cybill Shepherd and Bruce Willis are a just absolutely brilliant pair. They were just so like, I don't know how to even describe it. Like, you know when there are just 2 performers who are just so in tune with each other, and, like, their characters that they can just rattle off, like, nothing. It was so impressive to watch.

[00:24:04 - 00:24:56] Sharon Johnson

I you I yeah. You've you've you've kind of left both of us a little speechless here. That's that's and because I think we yeah. I think we both agree to to a large extent of of everything you've talked about, and, honestly, I remembered the show. I remembered how much fun it was, but I'd I'd forgotten a lot of the specifics, and it was eye opening to go back and start watching some of these episodes. And as you said, Sergio, basically, that they're they're doing things on this show that nobody has done since, really. People have tried.

They've tried to kinda capture that spirit a little bit, but not taking it to the limits that that this show did at its height. And, yeah, it's creatively, it's it's just absolutely brilliant.

[00:24:57 - 00:25:10] Susan Lambert Hatem

That is so I it's so great that that translates because it's hard to know. And, Sharon, high level first thoughts on the show.

[00:25:11 - 00:25:49] Serita Fontanesi

Okay. I didn't love it.

It was a little, and I and I wanted to because I I liked I liked the setup. We love the reverse rags to riches. The fun fact, the entire music video of You Better Have My Money by Rihanna is all about her business manager who ran off with a bunch of her money, and that's what she wrote that song about. And, like, the in the video, she kidnaps the business manager's wife, and and it's like, oh, it's and hijinks. So

[00:25:49 - 00:25:57] Sharon Johnson

I was I had no idea. I mean, I I I'm aware of the song, but I honestly have not clearly clearly not listened to it carefully. So that's I have to go find that video.

[00:25:57 - 00:26:39] Serita Fontanesi

It's about it's about her her old business manager trying to sell a bunch of her money, which is why never be too big to sign your own checks. But, yeah, like, you know, that, I love Schitt's Creek. Like, we I love a reverse rags to riches premise. Right? But it was she's so Susan. And I can acknowledge this might be the ADHD talking of just, like, oh, this 90s, like and and I and there were moments where I was like, that's funny. This is interest like, it wasn't a bad show by any means.

It's just the pacing of it was too slow for me to really be like, I want to keep watching this.

[00:26:39 - 00:26:40] Sharon Johnson

Okay. Okay.

[00:26:40 - 00:26:42] Susan Lambert Hatem

Very exciting.

[00:26:44 - 00:26:47] Serita Fontanesi

It's always coming in with a controversial take.

[00:26:48 - 00:27:01] Sharon Johnson

Welcome to my world, Sarita. I'm usually the person sitting in the corner while everybody else is on one side of the issue, and I'm over here by myself with my popcorn going, nope. You guys are all wrong. So totally I'm I'm I totally get it.

[00:27:01 - 00:27:08] Susan Lambert Hatem

A caucus of 1 in the corner. Different. Yes. And I'm right.

[00:27:08 - 00:27:11] Sharon Johnson

Well, I didn't wanna say

[00:27:17 - 00:27:21] Susan Lambert Hatem

And so when you went on, Megan, you went on to watch them get together?

[00:27:21 - 00:27:58] Megan Ruble

I did. Yeah. I and to be fair, I do wanna keep watching it. I do really enjoy it and wanna, go back to I mean, I watch we watched the pilot, but I wanna go back to season 1 and, like, watch it straight through. Yeah. I just wanna keep watching it. But, yeah, I specifically wanted to watch them get together.

I needed the, like, conclusion of that or at least the semi conclusion of that to feel satisfied before I walked away. And that actually, once we get into later conversations, I actually kind of regret watching it before this in some ways, though, because that is a very revealing episode about a couple of different things, like, in the conversation around feminism.

[00:27:59 - 00:28:01] Susan Lambert Hatem

So, is it feminist?

[00:28:03 - 00:29:36] Megan Ruble

Okay. Here's where I get stuck on this. The show is not about her. The show is about their relationship, And so it's hard to pick it apart in that way and be like, is it upholding her in a, feminist light when it's like she's so tied to him purposefully because it's about their relationship? Similarly, I don't think we can call something feminist just because the men are idiots in it, which this show is really great at doing. Like, the men are just idiots. It's kind of fun, but it's it doesn't inherently make it feminist.

I kind of land on it is because she is empowered. She is smart and capable. There are representations of other types of women on the show. Again, as I think we always say, it is certainly not, intersectional, like, but for the white women on the show, there seems to be a broad representation of the type of women that are presented, what they wanna do with their life, what their goals are, how much power or lack thereof they have in situations. There seems to be, like, a widespread. And so I'd say yes, but it's hard to say yes when the show itself is contingent upon this woman's relationship to this man. If you take him out of it, the show is not as interesting and doesn't really exist.

So, yeah, my answer is yeah.

[00:29:37 - 00:29:41] Sharon Johnson

Sounds like it's more almost a kind of sometimes.

[00:29:42 - 00:29:44] Megan Ruble

Yeah. Yeah.

[00:29:44 - 00:29:49] Sharon Johnson

But leaning more towards trying to get there, perhaps.

[00:29:50 - 00:30:29] Megan Ruble

Yeah. It kind of as I was thinking about that, I thought a lot of The Mindy Project, where it's like, I would definitely say The Mindy Project is a feminist show, but the entire show is about her relationship to various Glenn. And it's meant to be that. I don't think it is, problematic to tell those stories. It just all of a sudden becomes, like, well, if it's not about uplifting just the woman herself and Mindy Project because she's, it's about her relationships with multiple people, although overall, Danny, it ends up being a little less this. But, like, moonlighting, it's really about their relationship.

So it's hard.

[00:30:29 - 00:30:50] Sharon Johnson

Yeah. Willis, especially since it's I mean, we've watched I think Susan and I have watched more episodes than you have, but as as you go forward, there become more and more episodes that are about not necessarily about a case. It's more about whatever's going on in their lives, like Mulberry Street Tense is basically. So it in a lot of ways, it does become kind of a relationship show.

[00:30:50 - 00:31:11] Serita Fontanesi

Yeah. I mean, I think she definitely, like, held her own and wasn't just like, yeah. You can talk to me any kind of way. But to even still just be, like, lobbying those things at her, whether she can take it or not, 90s just bonkers to me. Because even in the premise of the show, right, like, she's his boss. Like, she owns the business.

[00:31:13 - 00:31:17] Susan Lambert Hatem

Sergio, is it feminist? Is it progressive?

[00:31:17 - 00:32:05] Sergio Perez

I think of all the things that you've had us watch so far up to this point, this one has felt the most ambitious in the conversations it wants to take on and the the way that it presents these things. Is it feminist? I think I sort of fall into the same category as Megan where I'm like, yeah. It's feminish. Like, it it's, it's feminish. Feminish. Yeah. Where I can see feminist characters, but, like, an overarching, like, concept and, like, what it is trying to accomplish might not be.

But, yeah, I I I think I'm gonna I'm gonna stay with feminist because that just seems like the buzzword. You know? And That's that's the sound right.

[00:32:05 - 00:32:07] Susan Lambert Hatem

Alright. And, and is it progressive?

[00:32:09 - 00:32:27] Sergio Perez

It's not intersectional. No. No. I struggle with if it's progressive or not. I I I don't think I don't think so. By the standards of today, I don't think so. Doesn't mean I can't still enjoy it.

[00:32:28 - 00:32:50] Susan Lambert Hatem

Okay. This is a probably a good time to take a break.

We'll be back. And we're back.

So, the dream sequence always rings twice, which is the black and white episode that has the introduction by Orson Welles. Do you have any knowledge of who Orson Welles was?

[00:32:51 - 00:32:51] Sharon Johnson

Megan?

[00:32:52 - 00:32:53] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yes. Sergio?

[00:32:53 - 00:32:55] Sergio Perez

Yes. Sherita?

[00:32:56 - 00:33:08] Serita Fontanesi

Yes. I do. Because, one, when my mom was a baby in Spain, Gordon Welles said that baby is unhappy because she was pride, and he held her and made her stop crying.

[00:33:08 - 00:33:11] Sharon Johnson

What? Wait.

[00:33:11 - 00:33:12] Serita Fontanesi

They were at a cafe.

[00:33:14 - 00:33:17] Sharon Johnson

Yeah. Start at the beginning. Leave nothing out.

[00:33:18 - 00:34:01] Serita Fontanesi

It's nonsense that story up well at all. So my mom is a citizen born abroad. She 90s born in Seville in Seville, Spain. My grandfather was in the air force, so that's where he was stationed at the time. And my mom was a baby, so my aunt was maybe 3a half, 4. So my grandma is by herself at a cafe with a toddler and a Babies 90s very fussy, and Orson Welles happened to be, like, a table or 2 over. And, basically, like, half joking, half not joking was kind of like, does someone wanna shut that Babies?

And and was like, let me see the baby and, like, bounced my mom a couple times, and she settled down.

[00:34:02 - 00:34:04] Sharon Johnson

I I I'm I'm speechless.

[00:34:05 - 00:34:09] Megan Ruble

Also, Orson Willis is not who I would expect to settle a baby.

[00:34:09 - 00:34:10] Susan Lambert Hatem

Like Not at all.

[00:34:10 - 00:34:14] Megan Ruble

Rather disturb a baby? Maybe. Sure. Not settle one down.

[00:34:14 - 00:34:29] Serita Fontanesi

Yeah. That's remarkable. Yeah. My my grandma, like, she wasn't she knew that he was, like, somebody. And, like, you know, like, his demeanor and, like, people around him. Right? Like, she knew somebody.

Didn't fully know who he was.

[00:34:29 - 00:34:35] Sharon Johnson

Is this a story that your grandmother would tell people? Is that how you know it, or how do how do you how did this get to

[00:34:35 - 00:34:48] Serita Fontanesi

the point? Come about this? It 90s a story that my grandma tells about her time in in Seville. But what's funny is it is not the story that she leads with nor is it the story that she ends with. Like, it is it is a

[00:34:48 - 00:34:59] Susan Lambert Hatem

middle story for her. Orson Welles and a baby in Spain. It'll turn into the story where Orson Welles stole your mother. Right on. Eddie

[00:35:00 - 00:35:00] Serita Fontanesi

Chit Knobs.

[00:35:00 - 00:35:03] Susan Lambert Hatem

Oh god. Took her to the bullfights. I

[00:35:04 - 00:35:04] Serita Fontanesi

Yeah. Yeah.

[00:35:05 - 00:35:12] Susan Lambert Hatem

With Hemingway. We're going to get Hemingway was around. Hemingway was probably next to him and said, Orson, do something about that baby.

[00:35:12 - 00:35:40] Serita Fontanesi

Right. They're talking about, like, oh, there were people around posing anyway. And my grandma was just like, I don't know. Your mom was being very fussy all day, and you're like the way that, like, the story like, the the interesting part of the story to them is that a stranger was able to calm my mom down and not, like, who the stranger was and, like, the context of everything. Like, my my grandma tells it as such a, like, tired mom story.

[00:35:42 - 00:35:44] Susan Lambert Hatem

Alright. That's fair. You know what?

[00:35:44 - 00:35:44] Serita Fontanesi

Yeah. Yeah.

[00:35:44 - 00:35:47] Susan Lambert Hatem

I'd let anybody hold a baby if it was

[00:35:47 - 00:35:48] Megan Ruble

calming it down.

[00:35:48 - 00:36:00] Serita Fontanesi

That 90s basically what she was like. She was like, your aunt was, like, fidgeting everywhere because she's 4, and your mom is frying, and I'm just trying to eat lunch. So, yeah, somebody wants to hold the Babies. Don't worry.

[00:36:00 - 00:36:10] Sharon Johnson

But doesn't it go really one of 2 ways when you have an infant and you hand off to a stranger? They either cry louder or they're so startled. They're like, oh, and then they stop. So

[00:36:11 - 00:36:25] Serita Fontanesi

Right. It was a risky move because it could've gone the other way, and my mom could've just really doubled down and been like, get me out of here. But she was so startled that she settled down.

[00:36:25 - 00:36:56] Susan Lambert Hatem

Oh, and and what's your mom's name? Stephanie. I all I'm picturing is a, you know, Orson Welles going, hello, Stephanie. You should stop crying. Are sure it was so joy to a baby. God? Small, adjustable.

Do you know I directed Citizen Kane? Do what I tell you. May

[00:36:56 - 00:37:00] Megan Ruble

we if we get if any of us get famous, may we all not be too famous.

[00:37:00 - 00:37:03] Sharon Johnson

90s. Words to live by.

[00:37:03 - 00:37:06] Susan Lambert Hatem

That is the number one lesson. Oh my gosh.

[00:37:06 - 00:37:11] Serita Fontanesi

Never be too big to not sign your own check and never be too famous to not hold a baby.

[00:37:11 - 00:37:11] Sergio Perez

That's right.

[00:37:14 - 00:37:20] Susan Lambert Hatem

It's so true. Alright. So, Sergio, did you know who Orson Welles was?

[00:37:21 - 00:37:27] Sergio Perez

Yes. I didn't realize that he directed, produced, and starred in Citizen Kane, which I have seen.

[00:37:28 - 00:37:31] Susan Lambert Hatem

So it had a whole other layer of him introducing that episode.

[00:37:32 - 00:37:55] Sergio Perez

Right. I mean, I was thinking about this while I was watching it where I was like, because they mentioned the forties in that episode because it's obviously, like, based off of, like, more films and all that, and, like, draws upon a lot of those tropes. I was like, wait a minute. The forties for the eighties are what the eighties are for us, like, today, right now.

[00:37:55 - 00:37:55] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yes.

[00:37:55 - 00:38:11] Sergio Perez

And that was crazy to me, just putting that into perspective because I was like, oh, so, like, just culturally, thinking about how much from the eighties that we still draw upon, it's definitely the same, and it feels the same for folks in the eighties to do that for the forties. So that's just where my mind went.

[00:38:11 - 00:38:15] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yeah. And it's kind of it that's a crazy thing to think about

[00:38:15 - 00:38:15] Sergio Perez

because

[00:38:15 - 00:38:31] Susan Lambert Hatem

Mhmm. Because it's also for people who grew up in the eighties, the idea you're like, you technically know it's been 40 years, but then when you say something like that, you're like, oh, that's how different the world is.

[00:38:32 - 00:39:04] Serita Fontanesi

Yeah. For them to be like, not only is this gonna be in the forties, but we need Orson Welles to tell you it's gonna be in the forties and that it's gonna be in black and white, and that's different than what you are used to. Don't be alarmed.

Don't be jarred. In the same way that I can think of other shows having to do a big setup for a flashback or for a time jump or something just to go back to the eighties Caron now, like, the nineties, or as the kids like to call it, 80s, which is so disrespectful.

[00:39:07 - 00:39:32] Sharon Johnson

Even so, there is a big difference culturally in the the the difference of the 40 years between the forties to the eighties Mhmm. Glenn from the eighties to now. They're the differences in the amount number of changes that the world went through in that that first 40 year period from forties to eighties, to me, is very different from the last 40 years. At least that's the way it feels to me. Susan, I don't know if that feels

[00:39:32 - 00:39:41] Susan Lambert Hatem

that way. It's more or Glenn? Oh, less. You think the changes are less?

[00:39:41 - 00:39:57] Sharon Johnson

Well, I'm not saying that the I'm saying culturally that Culturally. That the changes are less. I mean, there have been there's Cybill have been a lot of changes, but if you think about who people were in the forties to who people were between the forties and the eighties and how much change

[00:39:58 - 00:39:58] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yeah.

[00:39:58 - 00:40:31] Sharon Johnson

And the way things change as compared to the eighties to now. Yes. There a lot of the the cultural baselines have not changed significantly in the eighties to now as they have from the forties to the eighties, where you went through the civil rights movement, where you went through the women's movement, where the pill came along, where the Vietnam War came along and the whole antiwar thing happened. Those were we had a president assassinated. Those we had 2 and another president shot at. Yeah.

[00:40:31 - 00:41:03] Susan Lambert Hatem

I agree with you Mhmm. That there is there is you know, there were so many movements that happened in that time period.

And you're right. Yes. There was a attempted assassination. There was an assassination of a president, and then there was an assassination of a presidential candidate, and public figures in a way that, thankfully, we don't have as much. Mhmm. But, yet, so many nuances have changed in this last 40 years

[00:41:03 - 00:41:04] Sharon Johnson

Oh, sure.

[00:41:04 - 00:41:09] Susan Lambert Hatem

That are that is also very different. I think Yeah. I think the the speed

[00:41:10 - 00:42:15] Sharon Johnson

Yes. Is increasing. That's the biggest diff the speed of the change in that forties to the eighties is is like a a slow 90s is like a, a a bicycle as compared to the rocket ship that's been the eighties to now because of technology, because of social media, because of the Internet. But there's also this sort of compactness. For instance, there are there seem to be, young folks today in their twenties thirties that are much more familiar with music, movies, television shows of the of the eighties than we were of what was going on in, culture in the forties. There seems to be a marked difference there. And the the fact that we may have known about it, but we're like, yeah.

That has nothing to do with me now. Whereas now, songs, movies, television shows seem to last or the ones that hold on seem to last a little bit longer than they do now.

Maybe because there's

[00:42:15 - 00:42:16] Sergio Perez

not as

[00:42:16 - 00:42:32] Sharon Johnson

much of a difference in the let's take music and the kind of music people were listening to in the eighties as they are there is now. There's a there's a certain amount of similarity that there wasn't between 1940 80s. Music changed Yeah. Significantly. And and

[00:42:32 - 00:44:08] Susan Lambert Hatem

just access to information. Yes. What's interesting is, you know, like, I saw Citizen Kane in my senior year of high school when my high school English teacher drove me to downtown Los Angeles to see it at an art house Wow. Because I asked him because my mom wouldn't let me go to downtown Los Angeles Glenn, and none of my friends would go because I didn't know how to explain it to them, and they heard it was black and white. Thankfully, my English teacher, mister Ella Lloyd, was amazing and, a very special for many people, including me. And so he gave me some context for that movie, both before and after I saw it that helped me put place it in in film history at a time that I was interested in film, but didn't understand how to study it. Right? Like Mhmm.

You wouldn't have taken a film class in high school in the eighties. But it's interesting to think about just how different those decades are Mhmm. And then how the same. Right? That we're still dealing with a lot of the same as we've discovered in the show, we're still dealing weirdly with a lot of the same problems and questions and issues. Some of them were dealing with that we thought we had kind of put away and we're done Right. Dealing with.

And to really that insight of the forties are to the eighties, what the eighties are to now 90s just so kind of crazy

[00:44:08 - 00:44:10] Sergio Perez

to think about. Boggling, really. Yeah.

[00:44:10 - 00:44:10] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yeah.

[00:44:10 - 00:44:11] Megan Ruble

It's Yeah.

[00:44:11 - 00:44:15] Sharon Johnson

It's it's I think it's I think in a lot of ways, it's just really spot on.

[00:44:16 - 00:44:21] Susan Lambert Hatem

You probably had to pull up stuff on this show before you sat down and watched any of it.

[00:44:21 - 00:44:35] Sergio Perez

Definitely. Just because we've been Yeah. For those of you who are listening who don't know, I am an eighties TV ladies superfan, and I listen to every episode, before they come out. Sergio, may I assist such a vast knowledge.

[00:44:35 - 00:44:52] Susan Lambert Hatem

Works for 134 West Susan eighties TV Ladies and, helps manage our social media presence and, and so so, magnificently. Thank you. So, I'm also often throwing things at him and going, just trust me. It it was hot in the eighties.

[00:44:53 - 00:44:54] Sergio Perez

And it was.

[00:44:57 - 00:45:00] Susan Lambert Hatem

And, but you do a very good job given that it's not your natural habitat.

[00:45:02 - 00:45:05] Sergio Perez

I certainly didn't feel like it is. That's I'm amphibious.

[00:45:05 - 00:45:07] Susan Lambert Hatem

You over, win you over.

[00:45:07 - 00:45:10] Sergio Perez

Yeah. I live on land and in water.

[00:45:11 - 00:45:14] Susan Lambert Hatem

In the now and the eighties, as all good folks should do.

[00:45:16 - 00:47:31] Sergio Perez

Another thing. I absolutely love the way it portrays Los Angeles. In the pilot, I know that that was directed by Robert Butler who is like a television god. I just think it's really funny because I'm I'm like, okay. When he said that he was going to rip off Remington Steele, he, like, was like, let's do it. Weston Bonaventure. Diamonds. German. Like, let's go.

We're going in. And then he did it, and I was like, okay. This all seems so familiar to me. I did love that. I I love the, the physical comedy was something that was just so impressive. The timing of everything, the basketball going into the trash bin, then falling on, Elise Beasley's head, and then the ball hitting, and then her just standing Cybill. Like, that is absolutely peak comedy.

I think that that is like it and the thing 90s, it looks so funny, but people don't realize how hard it is to pull off. You have to be super skilled, like, immensely skilled to just get the timing of all that correct. And I I absolutely, like, was so just charmed by it. Also, Cybill Shepherd is a force. When she comes out in, like, the pilot episode like, all of her outfits are amazing, by the way. Yes. The timing of the season 2 finale where, like I said, previously, where I was like, oh my god.

How are they gonna wrap it up? And then they literally wrap it up. Like, they're like, okay. Let's go. Cut. Everyone's gone. Lights off.

We're we're leaving. That was great, you guys. I bet you Glenn Gordon Caron was up until 3 AM going, god. What am I gonna do with Whoopi Goldberg and Judd Nelson in a way that is satisfying? And then he was just like, screw it. We're gonna we're gonna do it again. We're breaking the 4th wall, folks.

And I thought that was really funny. Of all the things we've watched, this is the most, in in tune with my humor, I think. Yeah. Like, even, when they're doing the film noir episode.

What is it? The, dream sequence?

[00:47:31 - 00:47:32] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yes. Always rings twice.

[00:47:32 - 00:47:59] Sergio Perez

Always rings twice. At first, I was, like, watching, and I'm listening, and, like, the things that Bruce Willis is saying are finally processing where he's like, yeah, I play my trumpet out on the balcony under a flashing neon light because it makes me look cool. I'm like, yeah, That is what they do in those kinds of movies, isn't it? And I don't know. It was also really cool because there's just such a reverence for that genre in the way that it was presented.

[00:48:00 - 00:48:12] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yeah. Such such a reverence and such a joke. Like, it I I again, the 2 things that I would could I also think of community, and then maybe the Simpsons

[00:48:14 - 00:48:14] Sergio Perez

Mhmm.

[00:48:14 - 00:48:25] Susan Lambert Hatem

As as something that is both referential and nodding and homaging to a lot of things, but also sending them up. K. So last thoughts, Sarita.

[00:48:25 - 00:49:49] Serita Fontanesi

Okay. The aesthetic of this show was simply to die for because it's like and this is something that I've actually been reading a lot about recently of, particularly from eighties nineties, comedies, the style, basically, uniforms that a that a lot of designers were doing, for their character. Like, the one that, I was looking at recently was Regine from Living Single, and then they modeled Fran Drescher off of Regine. Like, they actually like, they do a lot of side by side of, like, them in the same outfit or the same pieces, but, like, Kate's a little bit for their specific character. But they each have this, like, style uniform of, how their outfits are put together. And, moonlighting follows that a lot with, Sybil. And, like, it's all like, for her, it's it's very 80s of kind of the, like, not super exaggerated shoulder pats, but a little bit of a a shoulder pat with the triangle top and the straight pencil bottom, but in these, like, gorgeous, like, satins and then the big lapels, and then that matches the, like, muted jewel tone on this, and then that's got a gorgeous clutch of the shoe to go with.

Like like, her style uniform is just

[00:49:50 - 00:49:50] Susan Lambert Hatem

chest kiss.

[00:49:53 - 00:50:31] Serita Fontanesi

Last thoughts. Like you said, I definitely, Modern for 90s time in that, like, you have a woman as part of the lead of the show. Right? Like and and she is is running things in a lot of ways. I don't know that I'll keep up with it, but Babies I mean, you guys have really sold me on the Shakespeare episode that I feel like I need to check out again as a Bruce theater major. And I just am so fascinated by the fact that Bruce Willis was, like, was essentially a nobody moving on to this Sharon, like, what a wild choice.

[00:50:33 - 00:50:49] Sharon Johnson

He had 11 auditions with the studio before they would let them hire him. And they they kept telling the the the producer, the creator, no. No. No. And he kept saying, this is the guy, and kept bringing him back in and wore him down until they finally said, no.

[00:50:49 - 00:50:51] Serita Fontanesi

Bruce your gut. That's that's a mess Yeah.

[00:50:52 - 00:51:34] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yes. And so there weren't any female directors, but this show actually had a number of assistant directors who went on to, you know, either be directors or continue in entertainment. And so there was a lot of lit there were a lot of women kind of behind the scenes. They weren't necessarily in the bigger roles, but they were given the beginning of their career off of moonlighting.

So That's rad. Yeah. I think there was an intention. We, spoke with, Sharon Maine who in one of our episodes, who's amazing, and you should listen to that episode because she's now a unit publicist on huge movies.

[00:51:35 - 00:51:36] Sharon Johnson

And she started in postproduction.

[00:51:37 - 00:51:42] Susan Lambert Hatem

On Moonlighting. And she started as an Allyce. Yeah. And by the end of the show, was postproduction supervisor.

[00:51:43 - 00:51:45] Serita Fontanesi

Amazing. Now that is very feminist.

[00:51:46 - 00:52:09] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yes. And then when the show ended, Glenn actually took her and a number of people with him to his basically, he had a deal at that point, and and they stayed with him until, basically, the deal ended. And then she stayed at Warner Brothers and became a publicist. So 90s, like, credits Glenn and Bruce Willis with her career.

[00:52:10 - 00:52:18] Megan Ruble

And the cool part is to follow through. Right? 90s the, like, we're gonna keep giving them more and more opportunities and putting them in spaces they should be. That's awesome.

[00:52:18 - 00:52:48] Serita Fontanesi

Yeah. And that's something that is still not common now. Right? And, you know, I I it's it's always interesting to think about, like, what are the trade offs of, alright, well, maybe her character on screen wasn't as feminist as she could be, but in some ways, they were really walking walking the walk of what does it look like to center a woman, to center women, to to center the success of women in in production as well.

[00:52:49 - 00:53:17] Megan Ruble

I have done a great disservice by not saying how absolutely obsessed I was with miss Depesto. Like, what a love her. Absolutely love her. Again, the episode that was not required watching, but her and Cybill Shepherd at the bar, and she just pounds the drink and then is yelling at the bartender. I lives, oh, in my heart. It lives in such a large place in my heart. I was so happy.

[00:53:18 - 00:53:56] Susan Lambert Hatem

And I had forgotten how great their relationship is over the course of the show, and they become closer friends over the course of the show and are sort of constantly kind of checking in with each other. You know, Sybil will check-in on miss Depesto. You know, Maddie will check-in on miss Depesto, and miss Depesto will check-in on Maddie and be like, are you okay? You seem like you're having a bad day. It it and then they have a conversation. You know? Usually, it's about the men in their lives, so I'm not sure where it is on the Allyce Scale, but it is a nice element that is not often an element of eighties television unless it's an all female show.

[00:53:57 - 00:54:22] Sharon Johnson

So You know, Glenn Caron said I have to keep giving him credit because he deserves it. He knew Cybill Shepherd was perfect as Maddie, and he knew despite all the pushback that he got from the network that Bruce Willis was exactly who he needed to play David Johnson. And you take either of them out, and there is no show, and we're not here talking about them.

[00:54:22 - 00:54:23] Sergio Perez

Right.

[00:54:23 - 00:54:30] Susan Lambert Hatem

It's true. It's true.

When you think about the other people they talk about potentially casting, you're like, okay. That would never have worked.

[00:54:30 - 00:54:32] Sharon Johnson

They might have been fine. Yeah.

[00:54:32 - 00:54:33] Susan Lambert Hatem

It would Hatem been a role.

[00:54:33 - 00:54:40] Sharon Johnson

Yeah. But they weren't going to take it to take it to that level. They just weren't the right person.

[00:54:41 - 00:55:04] Susan Lambert Hatem

And I think, again, they were both seemed so game. Mhmm. Even Yeah. Even even if behind the scenes they weren't. Once they were on screen, they were pretty magical. I also am gonna give props to Elise Beasley. And in the season 3, you guys didn't really see No.

Any Curtis Armstrong. Right. But we

[00:55:04 - 00:55:05] Sergio Perez

The expert. Right?

[00:55:05 - 00:55:23] Susan Lambert Hatem

The expert. Yes. When they came in to kind of fill fill in the gaps very clearly. I mean, Elise was there the whole time, which actually made me think while we Willis listening to this. I'm like, oh, it started off being she was the 3rd Glenn. So it was 2 women and 1 man.

[00:55:24 - 00:55:25] Sharon Johnson

Right.

[00:55:25 - 00:55:53] Susan Lambert Hatem

At the beginning of the show were the leads of the show. Even the Curtis Armstrong, Elise Beasley episodes, they actually hold up really well too. Mhmm. You know, they're not quite they're they're very different, so they're not trying to do them, but they're pretty compelling, and I truly actually believe that they potentially could Hatem done a spin off, with Curtis. But I don't I don't know if that was ever taken seriously.

[00:55:53 - 00:55:55] Sharon Johnson

Well, that's a good question now.

[00:55:55 - 00:55:55] Susan Lambert Hatem

Mhmm.

[00:55:56 - 00:56:09] Sharon Johnson

That could Hatem been great. Yeah. I really I think that their characters were such that that would've could've been could've been something really great.

If somebody just asked me, yes. You know? I could've explained to them just how

[00:56:09 - 00:56:16] Susan Lambert Hatem

Sharon should be running a network. You and Stan Zimmerman should have be running a network.

[00:56:16 - 00:56:17] Sergio Perez

Oh, that'd be fun.

[00:56:17 - 00:56:23] Susan Lambert Hatem

That would be good. That'd be a good network. I'd watch that. So are you gonna watch more Moonlighting?

[00:56:23 - 00:56:33] Megan Ruble

I definitely wanna watch more. I intentionally did not I did that one episode, and then I intentionally didn't do anymore because that one colored my judgment so much that I was like, okay. Wait. I I need to stop.

[00:56:34 - 00:56:38] Susan Lambert Hatem

So, Sergio, would you watch more Moonlighting?

[00:56:38 - 00:56:43] Sergio Perez

I think so, actually. Yeah. It's definitely something that I'd like to revisit.

[00:56:43 - 00:56:43] Sharon Johnson

Excellent.

[00:56:44 - 00:56:46] Sergio Perez

Because I feel like I just got a little taste.

[00:56:46 - 00:57:03] Sharon Johnson

Yeah. Yeah. Especially for network television in the late in the mid to late 19 eighties. Really? That they were able to pull this off and become beloved and become, you know, as as big a hit as it was?

It's it's kinda mind boggling.

[00:57:03 - 00:57:24] Susan Lambert Hatem

It's so culturally you know, it was the friends of its day. Right? It was the, you know, it was it was definitely something that that that landed and exploded in the culture Right. In a way that is hard to do now because people are just aren't watching, you know, not everyone is watching the same thing.

[00:57:25 - 00:57:25] Sergio Perez

Yeah.

[00:57:26 - 00:57:40] Susan Lambert Hatem

And so very little surprises us too. Yeah, because we have so much to watch. Mhmm. But how about that Whoopi Goldberg and Judd Nelson? Oh, yeah.

[00:57:40 - 00:57:40] Serita Fontanesi

Right?

[00:57:40 - 00:57:43] Susan Lambert Hatem

Which is Camille. Season 2 episode 18.

[00:57:43 - 00:57:54] Serita Fontanesi

I loved the whoopie episode. One loving whoopie, but, also, it was a faster paced episode. Like, because they had the, like, the title cards, like, put in.

[00:57:54 - 00:57:56] Sergio Perez

Devil in a Bruce dress.

[00:57:56 - 00:58:06] Susan Lambert Hatem

They played that. And the songs, like Yeah. And and a young Judd Nelson, which, you know, Judd Nelson's sort of over by the time you guys came on board, but he's kind of a big deal

[00:58:06 - 00:58:09] Megan Ruble

when we I don't know who Jed Nelson is.

[00:58:09 - 00:58:10] Sharon Johnson

I as I'm thinking Right.

[00:58:10 - 00:58:11] Susan Lambert Hatem

That is fine.

[00:58:11 - 00:58:16] Sharon Johnson

Yeah. I didn't look up the dates. Oh. I'm gonna guess this was

[00:58:16 - 00:58:22] Megan Ruble

Oh, okay. But apart from that He was part of the Bret

[00:58:22 - 00:58:24] Susan Lambert Hatem

pack. He was he was part of the brat pack.

[00:58:24 - 00:58:26] Megan Ruble

Yeah. That's why he looked so familiar.

[00:58:27 - 00:58:34] Susan Lambert Hatem

It came after Breakfast Club. Really? So he had become a star.

He had done St. Elmo's Fire. He was a star.

[00:58:35 - 00:58:37] Sharon Johnson

No way. Beasley. Way.

[00:58:37 - 00:58:40] Serita Fontanesi

So it was like a big deal that they had him on the show.

[00:58:40 - 00:58:44] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yeah. And Whoopi Goldberg had just done her first movie.

[00:58:44 - 00:58:45] Serita Fontanesi

Oh, The Color Purple.

[00:58:45 - 00:58:48] Sharon Johnson

Oh, gosh. That was her first movie?

[00:58:48 - 00:58:49] Susan Lambert Hatem

That was her first movie.

[00:58:49 - 00:58:50] Sharon Johnson

I've forgotten that too.

[00:58:52 - 00:59:07] Serita Fontanesi

I assumed that this had to be after Breakfast Club because of the, literally, the camera shots of Jubb Nelson gave, like, and here he is. Like, you know, when they have, like, the special celebrity guest star.

[00:59:08 - 00:59:12] Sharon Johnson

That makes sense. I just didn't I didn't think to look up the dates.

[00:59:13 - 00:59:17] Susan Lambert Hatem

I'm very curious if there's gonna be a new generation of people kinda find that show.

[00:59:17 - 00:59:18] Sergio Perez

Yeah.

[00:59:20 - 00:59:24] Sharon Johnson

Well, help them out, Sergio. Tell all your friends to watch Moon Life.

[00:59:25 - 01:00:02] Sergio Perez

No. You know what?

One last thing. Yeah. I oh my gosh. When in the Shakespeare episode, Cybill Shepherd pulls the Curtis, and there's just vases, and there's a label that says throwing vases. That is when I was like, there you go. There it is. No one's ever gonna top that. Like, that that's just they they set the bar in the 19 eighties, and it's yet to be clear because throwing Babies behind the oh my gosh. Don't even get me start I I got started, but loved it.

[01:00:02 - 01:00:09] Susan Lambert Hatem

I love that's one one of my favorite moments too. That's one of my favorite scenes in that, in that episode.

[01:00:10 - 01:00:46] Megan Ruble

I watched the clip, and I was like, oh, I need to watch this one in its entirety. As a Shakespeare person, I was like, yes. It made me appreciate the writing a whole lot because I know that scene decently well between Kate and Petruchio, and so where they actually pulled the Shakespeare lines and where they were like, no. We're gonna insert a joke here instead. Or where it felt, oh, it was perfect. I rewound and watched that YouTube clip because I was like, that is just excellent. That is some Muppets level nonsense, and I want more.

[01:00:47 - 01:01:04] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yeah. I think the show is at its best when it's at the Muppet level nonsense.

It really does. And and and season 2 starts to really hone in on that in the beginning of season 3, and they're just there's a lot of of kind of this perfect balance.

[01:01:04 - 01:01:45] Megan Ruble

It's one of the examples too, I think, that showcases both of them well. Because all of the, like, witty, zippy, quick stuff showcases Bruce Willis really well. But when they get into, like, physical humor or just being kinda wacky, they're actually both really good at it. So it elevates both of them, I think, which wasn't, to me, like, one of the most stunning women that could be conceived just being like, you know what? I'm down to be ridiculous and also deliver a one liner and also be super powerful and then super vulnerable and sexy in this next thing. How much exponentially hotter you get with to me, at least, with all of that is like, hot damn. Okay.

[01:01:47 - 01:01:48] Susan Lambert Hatem

That is so funny. I'm so glad.

[01:01:48 - 01:01:50] Sergio Perez

Glenn he parks his horse

[01:01:50 - 01:01:50] Susan Lambert Hatem

Yeah.

[01:01:51 - 01:01:53] Sergio Perez

That's crazy. That's crazy.

[01:01:56 - 01:01:58] Megan Ruble

Stolen directly from Mel Brooks.

[01:02:00 - 01:02:01] Susan Lambert Hatem

Anyway, thank you, Sergio.

[01:02:02 - 01:02:02] Sergio Perez

Thank you.

[01:02:02 - 01:02:06] Susan Lambert Hatem

And thank you, Megan. Absolutely. And thank you, Sarita.

[01:02:06 - 01:02:07] Serita Fontanesi

Thank you.

[01:02:07 - 01:02:10] Susan Lambert Hatem

Thank you. And, Sarita, do you wanna tell us about your podcast?

[01:02:11 - 01:02:40] Serita Fontanesi

Sure. My podcast, not Ugly Pod. We have 2 seasons of, and we're actually, insider tip, getting ready to come back for, season 3, which is very exciting. It's conversations with folks, exploring, how people think about beauty, how they thought about beauty throughout their lives, and how we can challenge the way we as a society talk about beauty.

[01:02:40 - 01:02:44] Susan Lambert Hatem

I really have enjoyed it. I've Allyce to a couple episodes. I'm really enjoying it. So

[01:02:45 - 01:02:46] Serita Fontanesi

Thank you.

[01:02:46 - 01:02:56] Susan Lambert Hatem

I'm so proud of you. Oh, thank you, Paige. And all of you, It's always delightful.

[01:02:56 - 01:02:57] Sergio Perez

Thank you.

[01:02:58 - 01:02:59] Susan Lambert Hatem

Bye, guys. Thank you so much.

[01:02:59 - 01:03:00] Serita Fontanesi

Bye. Bye.

[01:03:05 - 01:03:15] Sharon Johnson

In today's audiography, there Willis be a link in our description on where you can watch the YouTube playlist of fun scenes that we gave to the nineties TV babies.

[01:03:15 - 01:03:29] Susan Lambert Hatem

And you can find more about moonlighting and the team that got the moonlighting DVD released at moonlighting21. com. The link will be in our description. They have a ton of great content and interviews and a Facebook page.

[01:03:30 - 01:03:33] Sharon Johnson

Be sure to check out Sarita's not ugly pod.

[01:03:34 - 01:03:59] Susan Lambert Hatem

It's so much fun. It's also Women's History Month. Thank you, women, and all your history. But, I just wanna remind everyone that abortion access across the country is severely limited for Willis of women. If you need an abortion or want to help people across the country access vital health care, please go to abortion finder.org where you can donate, and you can also find out information.

[01:04:00 - 01:04:10] Sharon Johnson

Thank you all for listening. Thank you for your feedback and comments. Did any of you guys out there recently watch or rewatch Moonlighting? And if so, what did you think?

[01:04:10 - 01:04:16] Susan Lambert Hatem

We love hearing from you. Send us messages at our website. That's 80stvladies.com.

[01:04:21 - 01:04:33] Sharon Johnson

We hope eighties TV ladies brings you joy and laughter and lots of fabulous new and old shows to watch. All of which will lead us forward toward being amazing ladies of the 21st century.

[Singing] Amy Englehardt: 80s TV Ladies, So sexy and so pretty. 80s TV Ladies, Steppin’ out into the city. 80s TV Ladies, often treated kind of sh-[wolf whistle]. Working hard for the money in a man’s world. 80s TV Ladies!

Credits: 80s TV Ladies™ Episode 229: Moonlighting | The 90s TV Babies

Produced by 134 West and Susan Lambert Hatem. Hosted by Susan Lambert Hatem and Sharon Johnson.  Guest: Serita Fontanesi, Sergio Perez, Megan Ruble.  Sound Engineer and Editor: Kevin Ducey. Producer: Melissa Roth. Associate Producer: Sergio Perez. Music by Amy Engelhardt. Copyright 2024 134 West, LLC and Susan Lambert. All Rights Reserved.

‍